Project Kenai Documentation and Training: General: Kenai to Java.net

Eric Heumann

Posted: February 06, 2010 01:28 by Eric Heumann

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I was enthused to hear Ted Farrell's "Future of Kenai" update. While there still seems to be some uncertainty in the air, the prospect of keeping my project in its current form and having access to the Kenai tools makes me very happy.

It seems to me like a whole lot of people have already jumped ship; it'll be interesting to hear some of the grievances from those folks. Oracle definitely dropped the ball there, but in my personal opinion it's forgivable as long as they actually go through with creating a smooth transition for us over to a renovated Java.net.

I was wondering, does anyone know why Sun originally created Kenai separately from Java.net instead of just updating Java.net?

Also, I thought there was an approval process to be hosted on Java.net. You can't just make a project; you have to request one. Am I right on that? If so, is everyone at Kenai going to have to go through that process, or do you think they're going to open up Java.net to unrestricted project creation?

Those are some questions I had, but I'd also be interested to hear other people's reactions to the update.

Cheers,
Eric

Cyberqat

Posted: February 06, 2010 01:57 by Cyberqat

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Yup. The same reason things like this always happen in big companies-- politics and entrenched interests.

I agree this is good news. I *also* think that, however S'norcle wants to position it, this is so directly in opposition to the "vacate now". "Kenai isn't ready" and "we'll use it in house" announcements we previously got that I am personally sure this is a matter of someone at Oracle realizing at the last minute they were about to do something very stupid.

Stil, props for them in being able to see that in time.

vincent.c	Posted: February 06, 2010 03:48 by vincent.c » Permalink
	I trust Oracle/Sun not to change their mind on this important direction's update. This is a great decision. Kenai, with all its community based features, is currently the best hosting service on the web. I am very glad to hear that it stay. Guys @ java.net will be more than happy to hear the news too

Christian

Posted: February 06, 2010 15:42 by Christian

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Hi everybody,

first, I am happy to hear that "the infrastructure" will live on on java.net. Second, I think I understand the reasons why Oracle wants to merge the two projects java.net and kenai.com into one. Third, I am glad to hear that they are working on help for migrating the projects.

But, seriously, the communication on that point was not "poor", it was lousy! Actually, the lates Oracle news where a full turnaround and they contradict to what has been said before. Many projects did move to other sites and many of those did not see java.net as an alternative. Even worse, when I take a look at the projects which did move or at last started moving, those where the LIVING projects, not those dead try-and-forget ones, which also exist here (but which also exist on other sites, I think).

The "we will close"-announcement on kenai.com was far too early and much damage has been done. I will stay put with my (tiny and not too important) project, which is easy as it originally started out on java.net and moved to kenai.com some time ago. But you, Oracle, should be aware that a lot of confidence has been destroyed. So, just you cannot say you have not been warned, here are some obvious questions you should be able to answer in the future, or more confidence will be destroyed. I am sure, other project admins and commiters will be able to add more questions:

What about projects which are not written in java?
What about projects which live on both sites, for example, because they moved here before or where already moved?
What about the approval process? Though I understand that the open nature on kenai.com created many "walking dead" projects, I really liked it to be able to see projects which are not much more than ideas or maybe "classroom projects".
On kenai.com it was possible to add projects with a closed license and it was possible to deactivate anonymous checkouts. Will that be possible on java.net?
Will the kenai development team still be able to work as agile as they seem to have been working here on kenai.com? The delivered customer value in very short times and I am afraid that the process might slow down.

Some of those questions have been asked before and - though I also lost some confidence - I am still confident that you will be able to answer those questions soon. Even though my post might sound "angry" in some parts, I am happy to hear that you are not about to take away all the good things which have been created here.

All the best!
Chris

Bruce Schubert	Posted: February 08, 2010 15:38 by Bruce Schubert » Permalink
	Good post! I concur. -- Bruce

adamgmetzler

Posted: February 06, 2010 16:22 by adamgmetzler

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This is excelent news! Having just found kenai after updateing netbeans-6.5 to netbeans-6.8, my next project was going to be hosted here. Then 1 week later Oracle had their merger presentation and I thought to myself "well, this sucks, kenai is now dead". Man am I glad to hear that this technology will be added to java.net and I will hopefully have the same great netbeans integration you get here. So, my advice would be, IMHO, too wait a couple of months until they have the kenai back end under java.net, before starting a new project. I hope that mercurial support comes along with the kenai features.

Bruce Schubert

Posted: February 08, 2010 15:54 by Bruce Schubert

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This is very good news! The Kenai infrastructure is the best one I've found. As a result of the earlier shut-down notice, I evaluated a few of the popular (and less popular) forges, and none surpassed Project Kenai in my opinion. I played with the existing Java.net forge, and I must admit I was disappointed. The Kenai infrastructure should be a "shot in the arm" for Java.net.

I actually look forward to joining the larger Java.net community. Via the Kenai / NetBeans integration, it was extremely easy to find and get/checkout other NetBeans platform projects for help and examples. Thus, the larger community may provide a larger pool of resources to pull from, and contribute to.

-- Bruce
Campbell Prediction System Project

kwiecienm

Posted: February 09, 2010 13:27 by kwiecienm

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Hi,

There is another alternative - http://emforge.net - You might want to try this. We've just started a week ago and we plan to release SVN hosting fully working by the end of February. We are moving fast with very nice features and we already have some like task management, wiki, blogs, forums. But currently, when You create a project You don't get SVN - if You'd like one - please contact me (marek.kwiecien@gmail.com).

Kind regards,
Marek
--

HxA

Posted: February 24, 2010 08:35 by HxA

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Hi all,
Shortly after hearing the anouncement of kenai shutdown I moved my projects immediatly. And java.net was no option for me. Why? I host an older project on java.net and use some of the projects hosted there.
I always faced a lot of performance problems and the site navigation is horrible. The java.net team tried to update their site 2 times and it failed both times misserably making the platform unstable for weeks and ending in a roleback.
This is why I think merging kenai with java.net is a promise that will not be fullfilled. java.net ist a monster that needs a complete restart.
Sorry I lost confidence in java.net regarding project hosting and everyone waiting for the kenai/java.net merge will wait a long time for this to happen, a time with no improvement and minimal support of the kenai platform and then after a few years Oracle will realize that this is not going to work and just shut down kenai and you will have to hurry to move your projects then.

This is my prediction using my never failing chrystal orb.

Have fun,
- Bernd

Vincent Cantin

Posted: February 24, 2010 10:44 by Vincent Cantin

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Hi,

I have no more information that you, but I remain optimist. As you said, java.net have some problems and it will be hard to change it to support the features of the kenai platform. However, to migrate its content to the kenai platform might not be impossible, and that's probably what will happen (well.... that's what I hope).

I am also not 100% confident about the promises made by Oracle after such inconsiderate public declaration and so many silly project shutdowns (for instance, project darkstar was not costing a lot, and was an open way to more database usage .. which meant more clients for them). But because I am optimist, I will just stay until the end and hope for the best, while keeping a local backup of my files just in case.

Vincent

Paul McElwain	Posted: February 24, 2010 19:29 by Paul McElwain » Permalink
	My reading of Ted Farrell's note on the home page, "...migrating java.net to the kenai technology.", sounds like the latter options is what they are going to try. I have watched IBM, Oracle, and Sun over the years with their various support for open source programming. (and Dec DECUS before that) I am inclined to be patient, and optimistic.

Fabrizio Giudici	Posted: February 26, 2010 21:30 by Fabrizio Giudici » Permalink
	From what I understand it's clear that the new java.net forge will just be Kenai re-faced to the java.net domain and look & feel. So, I frankly think that the best option is to stay here.

Peter Mount	Posted: March 12, 2010 11:07 by Peter Mount » Permalink
	Exactly which is why I'm now staying put. I've tried a couple of other 'forges' out there, but there's been nothing that's just worked out of the box.